Take 137 - Showrunner JJ Bailey, The Hunting Party

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Any of us who've been in it for long enough, our entire career has been littered with jobs that we didn't get, projects that we thought were gonna go for sure, dozens of unproduced scripts littering with law.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

All of us are running into both major and minor failures in upload every single day.

SPEAKER_01 0:51

I do my one pitch button. What I've realized, but that won't be never one pitch but that won't be other spot.

SPEAKER_00 1:04

Welcome back to Screaming Into the Hollywood Abyss, a podcast about rejection, failure, and adversity in the entertainment industry, brought to you by the Emmy Award-winning annotation software scriptation. As ever, I am Dan Rutstein, your non-entertainment co-host.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

And I am still in the entertainment business co-host, Noah Epsilon. Today I'm delighted to introduce TV writer, executive producer, and showrunner JJ Bailey to the podcast. JJ is the creator and co-showrunner of NBC's new series, The Hunting Party. Welcome, JJ.

SPEAKER_04 1:41

Hi guys, thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_00 1:44

So I will start by saying something nice and then I'll ask a less nice question. So first of all, congratulations on the on the new show. My wife and I were we've watched the first two episodes, and it is right up our street. It's very, it's very good. Very, but I mean, I'm not I'm not it's not the right way of describing it, but it's very twisty. Um uh and uh we like twisty things. Um but it it's it's excellent. Obviously, in today's world, creating and having a network show is a a big deal and probably harder now than it probably was at other times in Hollywood history. And we will talk about all of that, but let's go back to the sort of so here you are. You're obviously great, big, successful showrunner of a brand new show on a network. Tell us about the earlier parts of your career, and I guess at what point did you think one day you might be the show runner of a big shiny network show? And how unattainable did it seem?

SPEAKER_04 2:48

Yeah, I don't know that I ever thought I was gonna be the uh creator, showrunner of a show. I I wanted to make a living. You know, it's it's one of those things where if if I could pay my bills and keep a roof over my head, I was gonna be happy. Um so I I'm incredibly fortunate to find myself where I am now. Um but yeah, I don't know that I never really ever thought uh seriously that this is where I would be.

SPEAKER_00 3:12

And in terms of your journey, like did you did you set out like one day I want to be a showrunner having been a writer? Or what you know, was it you wanted to be a stand-up comedian, actor, a novelist, all the other things that somehow get people here?

SPEAKER_04 3:28

Sure. Well, uh, I'll give you the sort of the abbreviated long version. Um, so I actually I studied business and economics in college. I went to school in in Santa Barbara because I wanted to serve for income. So uh I didn't spend a lot of time in class. And um I realized pretty quickly my senior year, I got a job doing commercial real estate in Santa Barbara as sort of like a class extension. And I thought I was gonna go into commercial real estate when I graduated college. Uh a bunch of my friends back in San Diego were doing that. I thought I would sound like a good lifestyle. And then I quickly found out I could not I could not stand the job. It was it was sort of soul crushing and it was not what I wanted to do. At the same time, my school, my school was a liberal arts college. I had to take classes outside of my discipline, and one of the classes I put off until my senior year was uh was the artistic requirement. And so I took this intro to theater class my senior year. Um I was also on the soccer team in college, and so uh a lot of a lot of us jocks did the same thing. We put off the artistic requirement until our senior year because we had a truncated schedule. We had to practice every day at 3 p.m. Uh and so my senior year, it was this ridiculous class where it's it's about five or six senior soccer players and then about 10 or 15 uh freshman theater majors in the same class, and our our professor was like the most waiting for Guffman thing you could ever imagine. The the very first we're sitting in the theater, and the very first thing that happens is he walks on stage from the wings and starts quoting Shakespeare at us, and all this joxa, like what where are we? What is happening here? And um had no reason to fall in love with it. Doing the commercial real estate thing, and suddenly I was like, you know, this theater thing's pretty interesting. I hated this commercial real estate thing. I didn't really like being on stage, but I got really fascinated with the plays that we were talking about and that we were reading and the fact that people were interpreting these things differently, and um I started writing my own stuff at that point, and as soon as I graduated, I was like, I'm gonna try to break into TV and film as a writer. Move to LA. And um the the short version is I did every conceivable job under the sun for about 10 years before I finally sold my first project, and um was fortunate enough to uh to meet some really incredible people who have continued to work with me over the years and really helped me uh get to where I am.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

I wanna uh thank you for that story. I want to add that we had a little bit of a pre-chat, and in that pre-chat, we discovered that JJ both loves soccer and loves surfing. So, so Dan and I almost didn't do the podcast because we wanted to just talk about that for about an hour. Um, so and and let me when I want when I'm gonna say something, and I want to say it in the way of like, I already feel like you're a friend, so I'm gonna say this in a friendly way that I was looking at your credits and and coming up with the introduction, like they annoyed me in a way that you you went now. This has been, you said a 10-year journey. So I'm not saying an overnight success, right? But from the looks of things, you have a couple pilots, busted pilots, but pilots nonetheless, and that's when I say a busted pilots, I don't mean that in a bad way for the audience because it's really freaking hard to get a pilot shop in in Hollywood. It's a huge win. Uh, you get an overall deal and then you get a show in the air. And so that feels like bam, bam, bam, triple win. But let's talk a little bit like Dan just mentioned, because we're we're we're fast-forwarding to the to the success, right? To the 10 years to get to to sell your first project. Was there ever a time where your parents were like, what the hell are you doing? Go back to commercial real estate?

SPEAKER_04 6:58

Absolutely. I mean, when I first told my parents I was gonna move to LA, they were like, You're out of your mind, what are you doing? Uh, you know, they helped me pay for college and they were like, This is this is what you're doing now. They were pretty uh not not the most supportive. They're really happy now. Um, but you know, at the time it was it was not uh not a great conversation. They basically, you know, I remember my parents basically being saying, like, okay, you're on your own then. Like if this is what you want to do, you know, let us know when you're coming back, basically. Uh and you know, I'm I'm pretty stubborn. And so I was like, well, I'm not coming back, I'm doing this. And uh, you know, I'm I'm happy I stuck it out. And super, super fortunate as well. Uh, my wife is she went to USC as a theater major. Um, she's no longer acting, but she understood sort of the struggle of all this. So to go 10 years chasing a dream basically was not something that she didn't understand. I I watched a lot of my friends, you know, I worked at a restaurant for years, watched a lot of my friends who sort of walked away from chasing their dream um because sort of like real life happened. And, you know, they either had, you know, spouses who were like ready to move on from this phase of life or parents who are putting pressure on them, uh, any number of things. And I was incredibly fortunate to have really supportive, uh, not necessarily my parents, but my wife was incredibly supportive, and her family was really supportive, which really helped.

SPEAKER_02 8:11

I I think I I love this story and I love it in a way that I feel like it's gonna resonate with with our listeners because 10 years, that this is sort of a 10-year dream, right? I think a lot of us come coming in, and when we came, people came in at different periods of time, but like for a lot of people coming in right now or even 10 years ago, it feels the dream feels unobtainable, right? Because it's just really been and it really is hard right now. It's always been really hard. It's always been a 10-year dream for people. And I feel like for people who are listening and they're at their seven, eight, nine, 10 10-year mark and are ready to quit, hearing stories like this at your 10-year mark that that you that you kind of sold something is gonna is gonna really resonate. But so I but but back to a question for you is like supportive wife, supportive-ish parents, right? In this, uh, did you ever at year nine go, I'm gonna like what kept you going when the signs were saying, hey, maybe this isn't going to work out?

SPEAKER_04 9:11

Well, like I one of my favorite stories right now to tell is um it was about at year 10. My wife and I had our first son, and I quit my job at a restaurant to stay home with him. My wife had a good job in uh advertising, and she was gonna go back to work, and I was gonna like stay home and take care of take care of our son. And I and she wasn't happy when she went back to work. She's like, I I want to be home with Jackson. And I was like, you know, maybe this isn't working. Um, maybe I do need to go back to San Diego and get that job in commercial real estate. And we actually took a trip down to San Diego. Uh, I sat with a friend of mine and was like, what would it take to get into your industry? I'm thinking about you know making a change. Like I was ready to, I was ready to walk away. Um, and it was my wife who said, you know, you've put a lot of time into this, like just give it at least six more months. Like, don't make a rash decision now, because uh, you know, we had a lot of change happening in our lives. And it was almost six months to the day that uh I sold my first project. Um and another part of that story that I I sometimes get emotional saying is I lived on the corner of Beverly Glen in Santa Monica in in Century City at the time. And I used to walk across Santa Monica to this little coffee bean and tea leaf to write every day. And there's a billboard on the corner there. And I used to look at it every day, every day across the street. It was, you know, whatever new show was on the air would be on this billboard. And I remember thinking, like, man, wouldn't it be so cool to have something on there someday? And lo and behold, one of the billboards for the hunting party is on that corner on that billboard. And I took the family to go see it. We were taking pictures at it, showing our kids where we used to live, right underneath the billboard. And uh it was a very uh very, very cool moment for me to feel like, you know, that that was that was a a crossroads I hit right at that like physical location, even. And and you know, thanks to my wife, I stuck it out and here I am with a with a poster right above our old place. So it was it was fun looking back on that.

SPEAKER_00 11:06

That's a it's a lovely, it's a lovely story. I think no, remind me if this is right or not. I feel like we had uh a chap called Robert Hewitt Wolf on at the at one stage who I think he was a show runner of elementary, and he told a version of it. I think he had like he'd inherited some money and it was gonna last him a period of time, and he was into like the last like $2,000 or whatever it was, and he was gonna have to move back to wherever it was from, and that's when he got his show. So it's it's a lovely parallel story and shows it's tricky because if it had been another four months, right? It might not have happened. Um, but but in living in LA, you know, we we had a guy on the other day talking about like he was waiting, I think his his movie was on a bus stop poster. I think LA's very visual for that. You know, if you've had success, you could you see it everywhere you drive, which I think is which I think is lovely. So I'm gonna cheat a bit because we're meant to ask only the terrible things, but you've sort of told us some of those. Let's talk about this show. So um when you do the sort of junk kits around these things, and when you see the press releases, it's like, yeah, JJ Baylor, creator of the show. Lovely. Tell us a story of actually creating it and getting it made. Like, how many times did it nearly not happen?

SPEAKER_04 12:26

You know, I may maybe not what you guys want, but it was actually pretty smooth saying. Oh, come on. So we um, you know, the the the big sort of upset to the Apple cart for us was was the writer strike. You know, we um I wrote the pilot, uh Jake Coburn, my co-showrunner, um, sort of signed on as a non-writing EP at first. And then when it looked like, you know, hey, the show might actually happen, um, he came on as a co-showrun because I've never, never showrun before. And uh he's an absolute dream to work with. So that was incredibly smooth sailing. We we were asked to put together a mini writer's room. So we put together a mini room. We we put out four scripts out of that writer's room where it was like pencils down right at the writer's strike. And and then it was sort of like this, you know, waiting period where we didn't know what was gonna happen, even though we knew like you know, everyone at the network were fans of our of the show, the studio was fans of our show, we knew we were sort of in that in the mix. But coming out of the writer strike, we didn't know what the world was gonna look like. Were they even gonna make pilots that year? Were they gonna make shows that year? What was gonna happen? And that was really the the the sort of sketchiest point for us. And then when the writer strike was over, they they ordered us the series. And um, you know, we've been fortunate enough to work with really great people at Universal and NBC who've had incredibly additive creative input. You know, I've heard a lot of terrible stories about development with people uh and studios and networks, and I will say my experience has been really smooth, uh, really smart and additive people. So, you know, I don't have a lot of juicy uh trauma to add to that, but we um yeah, we've been very fortunate with how with the trajectory of our of our show.

SPEAKER_00 14:03

Okay, so to make up for the no juicy trauma, I'm you know, obviously I'm very much not in the industry, so this may sound like a really poor question to all the writers out there, but I don't understand quite how this works, so I'm gonna ask you a practical question. So, you know, I know enough about the world to know what a procedure it is, um, but I guess how do you how do you find and pitch your the new show in the sense of there are lots of shows about people chasing criminals over the years, different different versions of it, obviously. Um there are lots of sort of prison breaky sort of type shows. Um I guess what what was your I uh like initial idea on this one? And also how do you then pitch it to these networks who've got so many other versions of this that makes yours like what is the thing you think that you pitch that makes this turn into a get you know enough to get bought and sold and be on the air, but also you know, as a watcher, as a viewer, it's quite very good. Like how how in a world of procedurals, how do you find like the hundredth procedural after they've already been 99?

SPEAKER_04 15:16

Yeah, great question, because you're right. I mean, it's a crowded field, right? And we've all seen a million of these procedurals. But I think the key was for for me was to show them something a little bit different, like because especially in the procedural space, like I think what the viewer wants is something that feels familiar in terms of like you know, you've got a family dynamic in the characters, and they're gonna be solving a crime every week. At the end of every episode, you're gonna get a a finality to that story, but then you're gonna tease them with a little bit more. Like that structure exists. We're not reinventing the wheel with that. So I think the big thing was showing them how our show is gonna be slightly different. You know, it's just a little bit left of center. And one of the things that we really hung our hat on with the show was you know, your typical procedural is a who-done it, right? You've got a you start with the crime scene, you piece together the facts of the crime scene, and it helps you figure out who your suspects are, you narrow it down, and then you find the bad guy. You're playing that mystery closed. Well, our show from the get-go, you know who the killer is. Like we're playing it open. So every week we're gonna get to go spend a lot of time with that killer, we're gonna get to be in that killer's POV, we're gonna get to see them do their thing, and our team is trying to figure out not only how to get ahead of them, but what are they doing that's different now and why? And it all sort of comes back to this crazy place called the pit, right? And using using that structural shift to show how this show could be a little bit different, but then also sort of teasing out that larger mythology that I think is gonna keep people coming back episode to episode. You know, it's it's sort of a familiar ride. There's a killer, we're gonna catch them, right? The thing that really sets us apart is what's that larger mythology serialized piece that's gonna be a big question mark that we're gonna piece out over the season, and then what's the new question we're gonna ask that we're gonna, you know, exp explore in season two? So I think showing them that it's it's a unique world, but it has these familiar elements that are gonna be, you know, ultimately it's a business. Like they they're gonna wanna sell this show overseas, they're gonna want to get as many people as possible watching it. And I think being able to show them how it has that uh uh approachability because it has the familiar elements, but it's gonna stand out because it has these new pieces, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 17:23

That's amazing. Uh uh, I was that's a good I don't like to compliment Dan's questions, but that's a question we've never asked before. And I do uh think it's so worthwhile to kind of like get under the hood a little bit for this because some of the stuff for me, you know, I'm living through it. Uh, but the but so I have another sort of under the hood question for you, because now we're we're in it, we're in the hunting party, we're talking about the hunting party, and and so you know, we were gonna have Jake on as well, and and obviously Jake got sick, so we have you, and that's amazing. But I'm gonna ask a question about the two of you working together. Um, you know, as a first-time showrunner, and you said, you know, and I'm sure you're gonna continue to say Jake's amazing, and I'm not asking you to say anything else, but like I I I've worked on shows with first-time showrunners, and and the stress is intense. It is like anything, nothing like, you know, like even people who've done it many times, they've they they can only survive because they've done it many times and they have that experience to when you're a first-time showrunner and you're in charge of this entire operation and you're a CEO of your own little company now with a lot of money and a lot at stake, it's the pressure can be intense. Can you walk us through a moment? Um, don't need to name names, where like you and Jake went into your either shared offices or one of your two offices, closed the door and said, like, how the hell do we handle this? Let's talk about a moment on the show that was a crisis and that you navigated. Again, you don't have to get into specifics where you're naming names, but like just give us the scenario.

SPEAKER_04 18:47

Yeah. Um, you know, the the biggest one that probably comes to mind is um how do I avoid certain things here? We had uh uh we had an episode that felt like it was sort of falling apart because there wasn't a steady hand at the wheel on the day. Um and figuring out how to step up because I am I am the showrunner, ultimately the buck stops with me, someone's not doing their job or not doing their job well enough. Uh it's my job to to stop sitting back and letting them do that and and step up and you know, either take control or help them find the right path. Um and we had a really stressful situation where an episode really felt like it was sort of floundering, and um was incredibly fortunate enough to have a great support staff on set to help step up. And um, you know, it was it was sort of like it was it was my first big crisis, and uh sort of feeling empowered to go talk to the actors, reassure them, talk to the DP, talk to our our um first AD, and sort of like help everybody take control of the situation was was uh was a really unique experience for me and one that taught me a lot. Um and I I think you learn a lot more from being tossed in the fire, I think, than from you know just walking in the roses. Um and I think that was a moment where I felt a little bit tossed in the fire. Uh but navigated it well, I think, and and in fact, I think the episode that came out of it is one of my favorites. But I think it in part because you know, so many people were empowered to do better work because they were sort of uh empowered to put more into it. Um but I think it took me and and Jake sort of coming to the table and saying it's time for everybody to do that because we're losing our way here. Um and and that experience really taught me a lot. Uh, you know, going into episodes after that, feeling like, okay, I've had that experience now. I know what to do if that happens again, and what to keep an eye on uh as we head into those moments as well.

SPEAKER_02 20:54

Love that. Uh I I I'm gonna I'm gonna circle back to something that Dan sort of opened with us, which is like you're this is prior to you seeing your billboard on the corner. You're back, you're living, you're you're living in that house and in Santa Monica, and you're dreaming about a job that hasn't manifested yet, right? And you are imagining yourself, as we all do, probably winning Emmys or whatever, or or getting a show on the air, or going to the premiere and you know, all those amazing things. So uh what is one thing that matched your expectations when you were in that dream state? And what is one thing that was totally unexpected when you actually reached the top? Wow. Good question.

SPEAKER_04 21:36

Um I think one of the most unexpected things was you know, there's a sense of I think when you're when you're starting out, you feel very isolated, right? You're writing at a coffee shop alone, you're writing in your apartment alone, nobody's reading your stuff, nobody's producing your stuff. It's very it's just you. And it can feel very lonely, it can feel very isolating. And then even as you start to sell projects, it's really just you and like a producer that you're working with, right? When we got into production, it was two, three hundred people working together to make this thing happen. And I went into it incredibly stressed, worried that I don't know how to manage people. I've never had I've never you go from writing alone in a coffee shop to being in charge of that many people. It's sort of like we'll see if I know how to do this, you know. Um but something that really exceeded my expectations and was such a joy was seeing how much passion other people brought to the table. You know, we I think we were also the benefactor of there was the writer strike before we shot in Vancouver, I think there was like 70-something productions filming there. When we came up to shoot there, there were seven. So as terrible as that is, and it's a huge bummer, I wish everybody could get a chance to get back up and running again. We on the flip side sort of had the the cream of the crop to pick from in terms of like department heads and people in production because a lot of people were out of work. And and uh as much as I wish that didn't happen, I think we really benefited from that. We got to really get good people. And so we'd sit down for a production meeting. I mean, people were bringing their A games, people were incredibly passionate. And it's a humbling thing to go from writing something on paper to having this many people working incredibly hard to make it come to life and not just not just doing their job, like you know, coming to the table with passion, with excitement. And um, I think that's that was a really unexpected piece for me because I didn't I didn't consider the positive side of it. I was only sort of living in this fear of, oh my gosh, I gotta be in charge of this many people. Um, and so to find myself in that position uh was was incredibly uh fulfilling and and exciting. Um I forgot the second part of your question, but that was definitely a part that exceeded my my expectations.

SPEAKER_02 23:52

And what m just what matched your like what did you dream about that felt like okay, this feels like what I was dreaming about? Man.

SPEAKER_04 24:00

Oh, you know what? You know, I we I something I was really excited about. Um, and and I think I don't know if it matched expectation or if it just lived up to sort of this idea in my head was being in a room full of writers. You know, I mean, uh I I I'm incredibly fortunate that I have a show on the air. Um I had never been in a writer's room before. And this was my first time. And yes, I was in charge of it, but it was really fun to to break story with a bunch of other really smart writers. And it was sort of what I had imagined being in a writer's room would be is just this incredibly kind of magical place where creativity happens and and it it really is that. I mean, it it's uh I'll credit Jake to this. I I think um he helped set a tone. I, you know, I went in there not really knowing what I was doing, just like excited. I think my excitement was palpable, and I think people really latched on to that. But I think Jake also helped set a tone of like there are no bad ideas, every idea wins. Like you you just you come to the table with ideas and we're gonna we're gonna throw some out and we're some are gonna stick. Um, and I think it made for a really comfortable writer's room where people were excited to come to work, excited to share ideas, and it made for a really great collaborative process. And I think that was one thing that like I think I had sort of been hoping for, and it really was the case.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

So I I think we're straying a bit from the point of this podcast.

SPEAKER_04 25:22

Um I'm a positive guy, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_00 25:24

No, no, yeah, you're sort of spoiling this a bit, but you're you're you're asking you answered questions very well. So I'm now going to ask another, I guess it's a sort of under the hood sort of question, but a slightly different one. And it's sort of piggybacking off what Noah asked about expectation. But this is another one. I've never quite understood this because I'm not a writer and I've never had anything made. Given that you've created this show, when it aired, well, when you saw the first version of it, the thing that you had been sitting there imagining for the last however long, writing this down, like, did the pit look like you thought it would, or did it have more windows and different structures? Like the lead actress, is she doing the things that you thought in your head that she might do or look like? And like the second episode, I don't want to do any spoilers, but the slightly odd, creepy man. Um, like was he more or less creepier than in your head you'd imagine him to be? Like when you actually saw it, what is the sort of I'm a writer in my head, I want all these things? When it's actually there, like what was better, different, how did that process feel when you actually see it for real?

SPEAKER_04 26:34

Yeah, it's you know, it's an incredibly strange feeling. Um, because you're right, as a writer, it's it's all in your head to start with. And then as I was saying before, you've got like two or three hundred people who all come together and add pieces, right? And they're all adding their own takes to things. And, you know, um I'll start with the pit. I it was it was definitely different in my head when I was writing it. And then we have this incredible production designer named Russell Barnes, who uh he did my first pilot. And as soon as this show got picked up, I was like, we need Russell, he's incredible. And when he started designing the pit, it was like yeah, that's better that was in than what was in my head. That's amazing. I'm not a designer, so like my idea of what it could be was limited. Um, and when he designed this thing, I was like, oh my gosh, that's that's amazing. And then, you know, there's there's a very long process of presenting something, me giving notes, Jake giving notes, getting a second draft of what it looks like, loving this, not liking that, giving notes, and fine refining and refining and refining and refining. And um, you know, we worked with an incredible uh uh VFX house to get the the the final design of this thing done, giving notes down to the down to the you know, we need more smudges on that window, it's too clean, you know, like getting down to the very nitty-gritty. So by the time it's done, you sort of forget where any of the ideas came from because we were all working on it for so long that it now looks like what it should look like, even if it's different than what I initially had imagined. Um and so that process was it was super fun too to be like, you know, I don't know, I don't know how to design a building, but when someone shows me I I can tell them what I like and don't like, and then they go back and they come up with something new to fix what I didn't like, but they came up with something that was never on my radar, and it's incredibly gratifying uh and exciting to see how somebody else's brain works of applied to this thing that I wrote. So super, super fun and super um, you know, uh uh interesting to see how other people interpret things. Um, you know, speaking about the the actor from episode two, I mean, we had always envisioned him a little bit more um like uh uh Dave Batista, you know, a big hulking guy who was like very physically intimidating. And we saw this actor do the audition. He's a big guy, but he was very almost like childlike. And we were like, oh my gosh, yes, it's different than I imagined, but it's better. And so we went with that, you know. Um, so that the process that there's a constant process of discovery along the way that's really fun and exciting.

SPEAKER_00 29:07

Brilliant answer. Well, I'm gonna go back to a slightly more, it's not a failure question necessarily, but it's a slightly more typical question of our podcast. So I'm giving you an option here. Do you want to see the hunting party turn into a uh 15-season-long sort of law and order SUV sort of you know, bear moth? Um, which obviously, you know, plus the gazillion dollars you get, but the principle more of you know, your show just being one that goes on for a long time and you keep guiding it, or maybe it continues and you do less work on it day to day. Have you got like your idea for your next show and actually creating another one from scratch and doing that? Which is sort of more appealing to you at the moment?

SPEAKER_04 29:56

Uh that's that's a really tough question. I mean, I I I will say, I think going back to those 10 years it took me to get my my break essentially, uh the thing I had to do was just constantly come up with new ideas. And so that doesn't turn off just because I have a show. Um, and you know, I have I have another pilot sort of in contention at NBC right now. And part of my deal with Universal is is to continually be providing new ideas and trying to come up with that next show. Um but it's a little bit like you know, my baby's out in the world, I want to be with it, you know. Um, and so it it it's it's a you know, it would be a um champagne problem to have another show go because then I'd have to make a decision. Uh but you know, I love coming up with new ideas. Um it's been incredibly fun working on the hunting party episode to episode, and I will always want to do that. But at the same time, I love sort of coming up with those new worlds and those new shows that could be um so it this is a non-answer because I I I'm not gonna pick. But um it's it's both really, really fun.

SPEAKER_02 31:04

We uh, you know, obviously for people who listen, they know that being a showrunner can do you in emotionally. We I think it was Craig Thomas, uh, Dan, you can correct me if I'm wrong about that, who came on and he did How I Met Your Mother, and then was asked to do a different show at the same time, and they created a new show, and that show got made too. And he said, like, it was like they had no idea they had no idea what they were in for. It's like it's like when you have one kid and then you go to having two kids and having uh uh was it having one or having one feel makes feel like having two makes having one feel like having none, right? That you have to do, and that you're now like there's just two things coming at you that's that's just so challenging, and this is the most challenging thing in the world. So speaking of the most challenging thing in the world, something a question that we don't get to ask very often is you know, your job is sort of to take care of the 200 to 300 people beneath you, right? You're like you're you're you're the father and the mother and the CEO, right? When you're a showrunner, you're your your job is like, is everyone doing okay and are we doing okay? And but how are you doing? Not only emotionally going through this process, because it's been a long process, people don't realize how the strike was a while ago. You've been in it for a while. Uh and you now your season one is launching, so this is like a long period of time. How are you doing emotionally? Have you had to make any adjustments in your personal life with your family? Like it's a hard balancing act. And can you talk a little bit about that?

SPEAKER_04 32:26

Yeah, geez, thank you for asking that. That's not that's not a question anyone has asked. Um, I appreciate it. Um, I will say it is incredibly hard. It's it takes a lot of time, it's very taxing. Um, but I have an incredible support system. I mean, for uh starting with Jake as a creative partner, a guy who he's got a little boy at home. Uh, I've got two little kids. We want to be there for our family. We kept ours uh in the writer's room 10 to 4. We didn't ask people to stay later, we didn't ask people to come early. And it was because we wanted to be with our families too, you know, and we understand that everybody's got a family and a life outside of this. We want them to be able to be be with uh with their loved ones. But that didn't stop me from showing up at work at 6 a.m. when I had more work to do, because that's what you got to do when you're the showrunner, right? Um and having Jake sort of as a support system, both creatively and emotionally. I mean, we were both, you know, stressed out of our minds at certain points, really hopeful at certain points, disappointed at other points, and to be able to commiserate with somebody else who's right there with you, going through the exact same thing, dealing with the same stresses, you know, it would that that's invaluable, invaluable. Um and then, you know, the the the studio that I work with, um U TV, I I've got a a couple of executives there who sort of like oversee my deal at the studio, and I've got a few projects in the work at the same time, and they really helped me sort of manage my time saying, you know, don't worry, like we know you want to get that done, and you've got producers asking for it, but don't worry about that right now. Focus on this. And they helped alleviate a bit of stress that way, um, which I'm incredibly grateful for. But then honestly, like having a family that is supportive, like my wife could not be more supportive. Um, I had to leave her for you know, six weeks to go to Canada to film. And we've got two little boys who, as much as I love them, are absolutely insane. And uh, you know, on summer break. So um, you know, it was hard to be away from my family, but you're so in it with work, especially when you're in production, you know, there's not much time to think about anything else. You're just so in it. And so to have a wife uh who is incredibly supportive uh means means the world and really helps me uh be able to accomplish this. Because it is like it is taxing, it is, it is sort of all consuming. And just like a lot of things, I mean, it can be as much as you allow it to be. Like it could totally take over your life. It could absolutely totally take over your life. But I I have found through mentors, through Jake, through other people, you know, uh the importance of finding not even balance, because there's not really balance. It's sort of like treating this like a season. Put your head down, do the work, but find those things like surfing or or like going to kick the ball around that can sort of help you relieve a little bit of that stress in a healthy way so that you can bring, you know, your everything to to the day. Because you know, ultimately this is this is a show that's got one shot. You've got once it's on film, that's it, right? You don't you you don't get to go back and try again. So um, you know, you want to be able to bring your all every day. Um and uh yeah, it really really came down to having supportive people around me. That's uh I I think even as much as it says JJ Bailey creator on on the show, it's it's it's a team effort in a in a big, big way.

SPEAKER_02 35:45

That's a great answer. Thank you. Thank you. What okay? So uh this is now we've kind of talked about the past, we're we've talked about the present, and I'm gonna ask a question about the future. Yeah. Uh the the you know, the the JJ Bailey that was in Santa Monica dreaming of probably joining the guild, right? As one of your like big game, and then um, you know, and selling your first script kind of goes hand in hand with joining the guild, and then maybe making your first pilot, which you did you did twice, right? Uh Echo and Getaway, and then getting your first show on the air, right? These are all I I I've said in the podcast before that just speaking for myself, that every time you have a dream and you accomplish that dream, it's surprising how quickly a new dream replaces it. Like you don't live in the accomplishment, it's suddenly like I did that and now I want to do this. So you've reached one of the pinnacles of Hollywood, which is showrunning your own show. So, what is JJ Bailey dreaming about right now?

SPEAKER_04 36:40

Man, uh, I mean, I want the hunting party to be a success. You know, I I think so far we've been really well received by audiences, and we're I'm so flattered and grateful for that. It looks like our audience you know continues to grow, which we're really excited about. Um, but you know, the thing I'm dreaming about most day to day is the hunting party just being successful and getting to make that show for a long time. I mean, I love, love the people involved. And you know, even when we were sort of wrapping up on the final days of filming, it was like there was so much work still ahead of us going into post-production, all this stuff. But it was really hard to say goodbye to the people I wasn't gonna see every day on set. Um, and I just want to be able to do that more. Uh, and having gone through this experience, being like, I want to do it again with a different show. Like it's, you know, I I want to be a little bit greedy. I want to I want to get another one because it is insanely fun. Uh I mean, it it really is. Uh this is this this may sound cocky or arrogant, but it's really fun sort of being in charge of the direction of creativity. Do you know what I mean? Like when you're the one in the room who gets to say what ideas land and what ideas don't, and where what direction the story goes, it's incredibly creatively satisfying. Uh and not only do I want the hunting party to continue going, I want to do it again in a different arena. Um, so yeah, if JJ's JJ Bea is dreaming about anything, it's about doing more shows.

SPEAKER_00 38:04

So talking of sort of other shows, you said you like coming up with ideas. This is a question, uh, maybe again it's a sort of naive non-Hollywood question, but you know, the only thing I know about writing is the thing that that man said, which is write what you know. Um but I know it's a bit more complicated than that, but like if you had a choice between having another hit and it's a procedural of a different kind with a clever angle, um, or it's actually a procedural or a non-procedural to do with surfing or to do with football or soccer, if you want to call it that. Um like do you would you want to do a show about a thing you enjoy as a hobby, or would it actually sort of because you'd obviously know enough to get that specificity, but actually would that like then annoy you when you're going surfing because you're worrying about like a show? Like genuine question is like, do you want to do a thing related to a hobby or do you actually want to keep your hobby separate?

SPEAKER_04 38:59

Well, I you know, I don't know if I if I have so much intention about wanting one or the other. I I will say as opposed to write what you know, I I've always sort of been in the camp of write what you're curious about. Um, and as much as I enjoy surfing and enjoy football, like yeah, I there's a curiosity to those worlds. I've never been in a professional soccer team's locker room, you know. I think that'd be fun drama to to write about. But um I think it's more for me, it's it's about finding something that I I'm curious about that I can quickly see the the natural drama in uh and the natural um sort of thrill in. That's sort of the space I find myself in, is drama and thriller. So um I don't know how you know a a thriller surfing show would go, but um you know, definitely not opposed to working in those worlds. I think it, you know, if the right idea came to mind that existed in those spaces, I'd be thrilled to write, you know, something about professional football or professional surfing or or just a surf culture thing, too. I mean, I I I love specific worlds, and I think there's such a a culture of football and a culture in surfing. They're so unique and distinct that there absolutely should be great shows that exist in those worlds. Um, so I'm not opposed to it, but it's certainly it's not something I'm necessarily pursuing either.

SPEAKER_00 40:18

So obviously I can't guarantee you a show in this realm, but if you want to be inside a professional soccer locker room, um I can achieve that goal for you in the next month, no problem at all. Um so um unfortunately, uh, as is often the case with these podcasts, even though this is fascinating and I'd love to keep going, um, we are we're at a point where we have to move to the final question. Sure. And the final question which we ask every guest is if you could give a single piece of advice to somebody wanting to enter the industry, what would that single piece of advice be?

SPEAKER_04 40:52

Don't give up. Uh that's that's it. It's it's hard. It's really hard and it takes time. And don't give up. I mean, if you're passionate about it, just just keep going. I think I think people discount passion. I I think it goes a long way. Uh and so if you're passionate about it, just keep going.

SPEAKER_00 41:09

Super, brilliant. Well, look, JJ, uh given the piece of advice you gave, tallies very nicely with what you said about your your literal and figurative crossroads. Congratulations on seeing the poster for your movie. Uh, sorry, for your show, and congratulations on having the show, which um I can actually recommend. And I I don't I genuinely don't say that about every guest show, and I often don't watch them, but we have watched the Hunting Clock and it's excellent. Um, Jimmy, thank you very much for being on our show.

SPEAKER_04 41:37

Uh guys, it was an absolute pleasure. I really enjoyed meeting you both. Thank you for having me. It was really fun.

SPEAKER_02 41:43

Thank you so much. Thank you so much for listening, and thank you, Game Planch, for the music. And I'm just putting up with our commentary. As always, each episode is brought to you by Scriptation. My favorite screen writing annotations. If you want to support the show, please download a copy at www.scriptation.com.scriptation. If you want to find me on social media, more remembering on social media.